Moving to France - Your Pros and Cons Please - Also, Why did YOU make the move?

General Discussion
61

Fortunately there are also good British artisans in France who have completed a full apprenticeship. My husband for example holds a City and Guilds in Carpentry and Joinery, gained back in the 80's and has spent all his working life being a carpenter, mainly in France. This means he has the same experience as a French carpenter plus he has the advantage that he speaks English and French, he understands English and French techniques and how can I put this nicely, has a slightly more Anglo Saxon approach to customer service.

I know this is not necessarily what everyone wants but we are all of differing nationalities and should embrace the best of everything rather than 'only having french TV, only having French friends, pretending we can't remember the corect English word etc'. We do live in France but the majority of us here are not French, so let's have the best of both worlds, that's what I do! And having a British tradesman, registered in France is doing exactly that, especially if your language skills are not as good as you had hoped they would be!

Sorry, I tend to have a bee in my bonnet about people knocking non-French artisans! Any one know how to insert smileys on here, I need one to say 'I'm not having a go, I'm just standing up for the genuinely qualified, registered British artisans including my favourite one at http://www.burgundymadeeasy.com

;-)

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Good point, only I mention French tradesmen because all tradesmen in France have to do at least 3 years training before they are let lose on the public (unless they are breaking the law and yes, you do need to check their credentials). As a result weā€™ve found the workmanship always to be of a superior quality to any we ever used in Blighty (and before I offend any Brit builders, yes, I know there are a lot of good ones tooā€¦I guess we were unlucky in London). Iā€™m sure there are many other european countries where diplomas are necessary to go into trade and are also superb workers, but obviously as weā€™re talking France here, so there are generally more French availableā€¦which is why I mentioned French.

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Some good advice there apart from one little thing!

"Only use French tradesmen. There are fabulous grants, and tax concessions when you do anything to improve/renovate your property, especially when energy saving, but only if you use qualified French workers (they are so much better anyway)."

It doesn't matter what the nationality is of your tradesman, provided they are fully French registered you will be eligible (subject to certain conditions).

Just being French does not mean they are any better than the non-French, it doesn't mean they are fully insured for the jobs they are claiming to do either! Always check out the SIRET number of any tradesman (bearing in mind that they may be registered for more than one thing - their APE code stands for 'activitƩ primarily ercercisƩ') and ask to see a copy of their insurance. The insurance document is the most important as it will list everything the tradesman is insured for and to get the professional insurance the tradesman will have had to show evidence of his /her qualifications and work attestations.

And I totally agree on the lawnmowers!!!!

64

You know what? I can't stand the post office. When we first got here I went to put a check in our account. I had my ID but had forgotten to bring my Bank card. Well the lady at the counter said "Sorry Madame we can't put this money in your account". I looked at her and said "Can't you just write my name in your computer and look up my account"? She answered that I may been trying to put my check in someone Else's account. SO WHAT? Anyway I told her that I had no intentions of putting my money in someone Else's account. But she refused. I closed my account there the next day.

I just think the whole system is horrible. Ever notice that discration line they have? About two feet from the customer. Ridiculous. And why does it take 3 days for me to get a letter from the states and when I send to the states it takes 7 to 8 days??

One of the things that happened to me was that I was living in a litlle village at one point. You know the kind who don't appreciate strangers. I had a lot of family in the states tell me when they got my letters they seemed to have been open. And took forever to get there. Or that they never got there. So I went to the post office and I used the outside mail box attached to the post office. I put my letter in the slot and saw a hand just grab my letter! I went in there and told the only lady clerk there that I was aware of her opening my letters. She answered "Well usually we just throw them in the garbage can". I reported her and she was fired.

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Come on that is the wonderful part of popping to La Poste - I have a business to run here in UK at present - you try our post office!!! not only first day covers, little old ladies, holiday photos, but we have cards, wrapping paper and the dry cleaners! It will send you straight back to France ! I have come out with my letters more times than I have managed to post them! :o)

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Ha ha haā€¦that made me laugh out loud Gill!! OMG Post-offices - donā€™t you just LOVE them! EVERY time there is some old lady either showing her holiday photos to the worker, having difficulty picking a ā€˜first day coverā€™ of stamps out of 500 odd or having lengthy enqiries into their respective friends and family. And theyā€™re not in the least bit apologetic eitherā€¦itā€™s horrid when youā€™re in a hurry - canā€™t decide whether to laugh, cry or have a hissy fit and just walk out (slamming as many doors as possible). If I see more than ONE person in the queue, I normally walk straight back out! BUT, then I do live in the sticksā€¦and the pace here is generally somewhat snail like!

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Ah, quick clarification. When I said queuing, I meant standing behind one person having a chat with the cashier as if there is no rush when youā€™re twiddling your thumbs and going slowly red behindā€¦!

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Well said Gill - I agree with everything youā€™ve said, apart from the last bit - Iā€™m defo in the right place!! :slight_smile:

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We moved with little thought except "escaping" the rat race. And it's not been a disaster. In fact, on the whole, it's been a great experience. In terms of the French language, I only knew a smattering, but it's amazing what you pull out of the bag when you need it. But it does make things VERY hard. However, I do think that you can only learn so much in the UK - you need to immerse yourself.

Pros: friendly people, less materialism, bigger house for less Ā£Ā£Ā£!, the fact that we have done something that, even if we do move back one day, we'll never regret (you regret what you Don't do,generally!), different perspective. HEALTH CARE (once you've got your carte vitale). I came over 20 weeks pregnant with my first and the care was great.

Cons: expensive - except property, EVERYTHING else, so cost of living not easy, financially you do need some guaranteed income (my hubby is a lot older and we have his small pension as 'back-up'), you need to have a plan of what you're going to do and... my current bug-bear - beauracracy! Just when you think you've finished the last form, sent off the last tax bill you didn't know was coming, along come 3 more. I know I probably could have researched things more, etc, but only by living it do you really understand it. I also tend to feel like I don't have any 'rights.' E.g. to complain at bad service, or when I encounter difficulties. I'm not French, therefore if I don't like it I can go back to UK.... whereas in UK I would stamp my feet a bit more...! Also, get used to queuing! :0)

Anyway, just my opinion.

I sometimes now feel 'stuck' between 2 worlds. The romantic, but sometimes hard, French one, and the old one in England, some aspects of which I miss, some which I DON'T. I'm not sure I'll ever be fully sure I'm living in the right place!! :0)

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Nooooooo Shirley, I meant ME, -- Me simply because i seemed to have done it all wrong when moving here, not speaking the language etc etc. If I have caused offence please excuse me, this is the problem of "putting pen to paper", as it were in print, I know what I mean and you would have understood pefectly if the computer could also put inferences in the post, instead of just bland words, which others read and unfortunately comprehend it so differently to that which was meant.

That said, I can honestly say I have NEVER had any form of hostility shown to me, even when an exasperated female clerk at the, Hotel de Impots, couldn't grasp what I wa trying to convey, only to smile and say she realised all the time, after I had taken along someone to translate for me. It surely is your right to critisise anything and anyone,whether married to a french person or not, I do it all the time.

In my village I am known as the "The dog marcher" because I take my dog out for a walk at least twice a day, and tend to march instead of walk,but it is always said with a smile and a kiss on both cheeks.

Once again I would like to apologise to you unreservedly if have offended you, or any others.

71

Do your home work is the best advice anyone can ever offer. If you are heading out and thinking of being self-employed have you done all the calculations, got your business plan and do you have plan B!!!!!

France is a wonderful place and offers a wonderful lifestyle for those who have a regular income - but so many Brits end up penny-less and lose everything through not doing the maths before they head off to live the dream.

We have been lucky and although things have not gone quite as planned we now have homes both sides of the water, a successful business in the UK and plans for one in France too, one which will hopefully help people like yourself to make sure the move is made with eyes wide open and all the calculations correct. If you are considering self employment at all do drop me a line - we hope to run our first business ideas workshop in France soon.

Hope it all goes well, whatever your decision.

72

I also fell in love with France a long time ago. My mom was french so we'd vist every year here. My dream was always tolive here.

Meanwhile I got married and it took alot of convening for my husband to even come with me for a visit. But he did and he fell in love as well.

I spoke French fluently but Dave had to learn it. It wasn't easy. And though he specks with a deep American accent he specks flunently. Now!

I love the beauty of this country. The culture. The only thing I can complain about is the many hard times I have had with unemployment. I've done a few jobs. I worked at the open market in Castres selling books and antiques. I also worked at a school being an Narc in a school for awhile and also teaching English. But was laid off because of government cuts.

So it hasn't been easy. Dave works building mobile homes for a company in Relmont. He also does gardening sometimes for a little extra income.

All I know is you really got to love this country to stay through rough times. And I guess we really do! We never been this poor!!

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@ Harry - I don't think anyone was 'disagare ing' with anything? Just different and equally valid perspectives.

At the end of the day, everyone's experiences will be different and equally valid.

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Ohhhh dear, why does there always have to be one that disagrees with so much good advice.

I personally have had this love affair with France for many years, it all started when serving in the R.A.F. (in peacetime) we became stranded here and had to spend nearly two weeks waiting for parts to arrive from Germany, as we wandered around i realised what a really lovely place this was, but in those days, so backward, especially in the rural areas.

Move forward now nearly fifty years, I am getting older, have been running a business for years and am realising the "big Boys" show no mercy where trading is concerned.My wife and I had spent a few holidays here, golfing /leisure/etc, but she was not as enamoured with the place as me, and she was , at the time, pooh poohing the idea of living here, and like most long time married males I would usuallyy give in , just to keep the peace, but this was something different.

I am six years older than my wife,so we decided to retire together, told her I did NOT want to turn into a couch potato, and that I needed more stimulus than just golf, fishing, and pottering around in the garden, so lets move to France to live ---- her problems were --we could speak hardly a word od French --- we knew NOTHING of the French culture etc etc etc. and if we were to move she wanted a ---bolt hole -- to return to should things go wrong, (which we couldn't afford\) To cut a long story short, our marriage nearly ended in divorce as i was determined this time to get my way, we sold EVERYTHING we owned and moved here.

Four years later my French is passable, we still cant read or write it very well, and I learned VERY early on that you don't ask the french if they speak English, you always tell them your French is poor so please understand, it works EVERY time, they smile, slow their speech down and are genuinely interested in you simply because you are TRYING to speak with them in their own tongue.

My wife now loves it here and regards going back to the U.K to see her very aging parents a bind, not the parents,the country, what it is becoming etc etc. Our kids WANT to come and see us, as do the grandchildren because its an adventure and not something Mum and Dad MAKE them do

The only advice would offer any person coming to live here, by all means have English speaaking friends -- but for gods sake------------ STAY AWAY FROM THE BRIT PACKS.

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Totally agree with you Shirleyā€¦!!! Even though I find Iā€™m saying words I didnā€™t even realised I knew when completely plasteredā€¦I still manage to feel as if Iā€™m 5 from time to time!! LOL. Also, quite a lot of older people think they can pick up the language quickly, but find that the older they get, the harder it gets. Some are lucky, and pick things up really quickly, but I know some that have never, and probably will never master a new language! That being the case, they are still happy over here because they surround themselves with expats and French people who speak good English. Wish I knew the odd English speaker when I first cameā€¦I had to rely on my toothless, one-eyed neighbour who had speach impediment and not one word of English! ha ha

76

I agree with Suzie's advice but would add that to me most of that is done here - learning about the french and the way they live can only be done in France. There are lots of opportunities to learn the language here if you don't speak very good french (we didn't but we have learnt and are still learning loads and to me it's all part of the experience and humour!)

The financial side of things is sound advice and particularly the medical care needs looking into, especially as you have children - the best book that I use is called Living and working in France by David Hampshire ISBN 1 901130 08 8 - it's invaluable.

Good luck :-)

77

Be well prepared in advance. Learn the language - so many people think they can wing it without - not true and makes life 100 times more difficult. Make sure at least one of you has a guaranteed income, even if it is small, you will find that your money goes very quickly. (It's unrealistic to think that you can live the 'French Dream' by living off the land and having one or two small gites. Make sure you have savings to live on for at least 3 years in case of unemployment or a disaster! Only use French tradesmen. There are fabulous grants, and tax concessions when you do anything to improve/renovate your property, especially when energy saving, but only if you use qualified French workers (they are so much better anyway). Talk to your mayor, and to the locals/neighbours - they can give excellent practical advice ie, when the bins are emptied, which tradesmen are best recommended, nearest dump, where to buy wood for your fire etc etc. Volunteer to help with fetes and carnivals - your efforts will be so appreciated and you'll grasp the language so much faster. Arm yourself with as many reference books as possible before you leave - a godsend.

We moved to the Loire over 10 years ago and have never regretted it. I can honestly say that there have never been any 'cons' that we have encounted whilst living here, only 'pros'. The only thing I wish I knew before I made the move, or at the beginning of our stay, was not to buy middle-of-the-road garden machinery ......when you have a lot of land, you should save up and only buy the best because everything else conks out within a year or two (we've wasted so much money on lawnmowers....arrrgg).

We moved to France because it was somewhere where we had always wanted to be. We love the wines, the food, the language, the charm, the people....I could go on for hours! My husband continues with his career as a tax specialist and finds it far more relaxing working from home and liasing with his US/UK and European clients (it's all done on the internet these days) and it gives him the time to work in his vineyard and realise his dream of being a wine-maker. I now have plenty of time to continue writing my novels.....I was too stressed in London to concentrate on them then!

I wish you every luck in the world - go for it, you WILL enjoy it.

Best wishes, Suzie

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Hi - we didn't give it too much thought before we came, it just felt right for us and an adventure! We're so glad we did it although some things have been far harder than we considered, for example picking up the language, but we're getting there and not causing us too many problems. For our family benefits and way of life we can find no cons and a whole lot of pros. Our kids have so much more freedom here than they would have in the UK and the schooling and discipline is superb. Our medical experiences here are second to none - I had my daughter here so was hospitalised for the birth - fantastc!

We don't go back to the UK, we have everything we want and need here :-)