Renewal of Carte de Sejour

Yes it looks like a small pocket calculator:

NW-card-reader

It’s not all that hard to operate; there is a slot in the top into which you insert your bank card.

It’s just that because the screen is not backlit you need to use it in a well lit environment to be able to read the screen easily, and you have to go through a sequence of options to confirm your transaction.

I believe it’s a device used by several banks within the VISA network in the UK, but whether French banks issue them I don’t know.

Is there not a possibility that underused accounts could closed? NW seem to be having a tidy up at the moment.

I’m fairly sure they don’t @ChrisMann . You have to either use a Smartphone, or, in the case of CA, any sort of mobile phone plus a personal code given you initially by the bank. Some banks (CIC, Credit Mutuel) will give you a DigiPass, which acts instead of a smartphone. It’s keyed to your bank account and you use it to scan a QR code, like Smartphones do, but that’s all it does.

no idea about the future… we let the balance build up until it’s worthwhile… then we use it to “treat” family in UK… or transfer some here… just depends… but we’ve had no hint of a problem with that UK bank.

so it’s just like the ones in the shops around here…
nope, I don’t need one of my own… it’sjust another bit of stuff I’d use so infrequently I’d lose it…
plus with my dodgy eyes and fingers, I might “light a blue touch paper” by mistake… oooops… :rofl:

I like a nice big keyboard for touch-typing and a good sized screen… my computer is my (almost) best friend.

OK must be a UK thing then…

I think so. I had several at one time - one from each bank but actually they all worked for each bank so I had lots of effective spares! Still got the Nationwide one since I kept the account.

When applying online (via the ‘ANEF’* platform) for a CdS, including a renewal, I notice they have now inserted the demand for signing of the ‘contrat d’engagement’ into this process, ie agreement by the applicant to its terms is yet another condition for approving the granting of the CdS.

The contrat is a two pager basically requiring the acceptance of French ‘republican values’ eg respect for égalité, religious tolerance etc etc. Jane helpfully linked to this document a few weeks ago.

Despite the rather intimidating ‘mandatory’ wording (of the dialogue box that appears), the small print accompanying the contrat does accept that signing it is voluntary for EU nationals and their families, EEA nationals and their families, and Withdrawal Agreement Brits.

*Administration Numérique des Étrangers en France

EDIT here is Jane’s note

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Hi All

On the topic of renewal ( spouse of EU citizen)…arrived last October and did not receive first CDS until April. ,( 1 year only ). I was disappointed as it should have been minimum 5 year card.

2 questions, i assumed i do not start renewal process until December . However now wondering if I should have started renewal from arrival date ?
My original prefecture was Limoges but now Poitiers. I did do change of address when we moved.
So question 2 as i have not started yet wondering if there is anywhere i can request a 4 year card rather than ending up with just another year ?
Like George my income pensions more than EU Spouse so will be including all joint income :slight_smile:

I’m just wondering… what was the “start date” on the CdS which you received in April… ???

I’m presuming it does have a “start” and “finish” date… :wink: :wink:

I have no idea… just throwing in my thoughts…

Example:
The non-EU-spouse has more income than the EU-person…
They might be wondering, does the EU-Person have sufficient income in their own right ??

so I’m just questioning if the 1-year CdS is being given, due to the “authorities” taking a "gently, gently… let’s see how things go for while… " attitude.
Rather than issuing the 5-year one to the Non-EU-Spouse “just like that” .

Erring on the side of caution…if you get my drift
and absolutely no reflection on you personally…

I’m just suggesting this is how they might make a decision which covers everyone in this situation…

Hola Stella

No.offence taken i totally understand your reasoning.

His income is sufficient for him alone but not the two of us. I have a few private pensions plus a small one from when living, working in Channel Islands and my OAP.
Tbh until Georges post i assumed they took all income into account. I believe George received a 5:year and he said spouse has nil income lol.
I think it really depends as said before on multiple gov things. Who you are dealing with, what prefecture and how well they know the rules.
I know another person also oy received 1 year Limoges and 1 that git the ,5 year.

I sincerely hope not just based on him as it seems unreasonable if living together that both incomes be taken into account.
When i went to have fingerprints taken insubmitted extra paperwork and a spreadsheet showing savings plus all our pensions.

Start date 27/03/24 to 26/03/25. So assuming i reapply 4 months before 26/03?

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Hi Tranmere. I would be inclined to see what the online CdS application platform (ANEF) will let you do. I would try to apply for an initial 5 year card, ie give them the usual details required to take you right up to date as if this was the first time of applying. In the box at the end of the process explain that you should have been given an initial 5 year card (there is definitely no one year card for EU family members as we both know - it was probably an example of a Prefecture totally ignoring the rules) and ask for the five year card, minus the year or so already enjoyed. That would turn get you back into the correct cycle of 5 years initially, then a 10 year renewal CdS.

I would also agree with you that you should show combined family income based on your scenario, as you say, also identical to mine. Make it clear whose income/assets you’re evidencing so there is no question of misleading them. As I’ve said earlier, common sense suggests this approach will hopefully satisfy them that collectively you have sufficient resources to avoid being a burden on the French taxpayers, whereas slavishly following their requirements would give the incomplete answer, ie that your spouse alone does not have sufficient resources.

Do keep us in the loop as to what happens. Best of luck!

I’m really trying to find some sort of logic to “someone’s” thinking… ( that someone lurking in the darkest corner of bureaucracy :wink: )

Until recently I was not aware that an EU person didn’t have the “absolute right” to stay in France more than the 3 months, without applying for and being granted a Visa…
the non-visa has been (and still is) just a friendly “nicety” between nations… :wink:

if push ever comes to shove… an EU person might be asked to show that they do fulfil the official French requirements…

Now you and I know that commonsense does/should prevail in the end… but there can be that annoying little cog-in-the-wheel… who insists that blah blah blah…

However, I am quietly confident that anyone who has shown they can and do “survive france” for some years… will not be turned out… unless they do something absolutely dastardly …
and even then, from recent Press, there are bad-people who have been told to quit France years ago, yet are still here… and many have become multiple re-offenders… aaaargh.

I’m really looking forward to the happy outcome for @Tranmere and @George1 when they request their renewals… :+1: :+1:

An EU person cannot apply for a visa to move to another eu country because no such visa exists.
They have the right to live in another eu country subject to the conditions for freedom of movement, which include having sufficient income/resources not to become a burden on their host country.
This would only be checked if the person applies for a carte de séjour. There is no general obligation for every eu citizen who is exercising fom to hold a cds but some wish to have one and there are certain situations where it is necessary or at least, where it simplifies administrative processes.

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apologies… I should have said… “not have the absolute right to stay in France more than the 3 months, without being able to fulfil the requirements for a Visa… ie finances and other stuff…”

and it’s clearly stated that even if the EU person has finances “under the limit”… if they’ve managed OK in France, for a certain length of time… their low finances cannot be “used against them”.
So, as you say, if they don’t draw attention to themselves… they can just sit quietly and let the time pass… gently gently…

I think we’re both on the same wavelength… I’m just a bit tired and frazzled. sorry.

The point is though that it’s not about visas. A visa is a stamp in a passport that gives a foreigner permission to enter a country for a specific agreed purpose subject to specific conditions relating to the purpose of the visa eg salarié, entrepreneur, inactif etc.
None of this applies to eu citizens. They are covered by the fom directive instead.
As you say there is a lot of tolerance for eu citizens. They won’t be asked to leave.
But being tolerated is a bit different from being automatically entitled to full privileges. Which is why vetting has to be done before certain privileges are officially granted.

I’m sure that in this case once they have all the documents they need to enable them to tick the boxes all will be well, but the boxes do need to be ticked before documents can be issued.

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Hi George

I cant say i ever saw anywhere i could down length of card i am applying for?

I suppose i can just try to add a comment st the end and attach the relevant legislation. ? :smiley:

Hi Stella

Not sure if i am.reading this correctly ?

Until recently I was not aware that an EU person didn’t have the “absolute right” to stay in France more than the 3 months, without applying for and being granted a Visa…

I understood my other hal EU passport does not need to apply for a visa or CDS.

You are quite right, Tranmere, that there is nowhere where you are explicitly told about the length of a CdS for an EU family member in the application process online. However the ANEF platform will assume you are either renewing your CdS or starting a first application. In the box right at the end you can state why you are requesting a card to take you up to the 5 year point that you should have been issued with originally…I don’t think there is a facility to attach a document to this section (I could be wrong I just don’t recall seeing it).You could helpfully cut and paste a section from the regulations (in French) to show the period they should have granted you (ie the 5 years). Obviously no guarantee but it seems a reasonable approach to try and correct a obvious error in the first place by your initial Prefecture. I’ve attached the regs in French.

Article 11(1) sets out the 5 year term.

EU Directive 2004 38 FR.pdf (170.1 KB)