Residency Online Applications

The conditions were just the same as for any EU citizen settling in an EU state that was not their own. The UK like France did not require registration so both countries have ended up with a problem of undocumented residents that they are now both addressing.

I agree that if there had been a tighter rein on EU immigration that Brexit would never have happened. Four million immigrants is a lot for a country to handle in such a short period of time & it doesn’t help when there are very high concentrations of predominantly young unskilled males in some areas of the country.

The freedom of movement directive made provision for states to impose certain conditions to ens ure incomers do not become a burden. France ha s legislation on this, as set out on the public service website. Spain also has an income requirement. Most countries do. The UK did not.

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Most of the general provisions are quite hard to trigger - the specific case where the UK did not take advantage of the ability to limit immigration was following the 2004 expansion of the Union.

That said, I wonder how we would have policed it exactly?

The French government has learned from its previous mistakes of not being able to follow people (e.g. terrorist attacks, fake ID papers) and has implemented a system that now allows them to match your fingerprint to a scene of investigation, or even just for verification purposes, should you ever be arrested, or when you leave/enter the country via a port or airport (land borders of course, are another thing). From an internal security perspective, that’s quite a leap forward compared to the UK, that is still hesitant to introduce even ID cards…yet has CCTV cameras almost everywhere, and is still incapable of tracking a person reliably. Just to put things in perspective, as I get the distinct impression you are sniping at the French from the sidelines, the RDV was always required, as was the paperwork, same for any non-French citizen wishing to obtain a TdS. Even French citizens have to have their fingerprints taken when they apply for a passport or an ID card (nowadays). Why should Brits be treated any differently ?

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I would add that if you think you’ve got it bad here, try immigration control in the US, where you get a retinal/facial scan and a complete fingerprint scan taken on entry.

I’ve only visited the US once, in 2003 - I wouldn’t mind going again but am totally put off by the fact that they treat you like a criminal for daring to want to stay in their country for a week.

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Hadn’t been for a few years, and went last year for business, and it has definitely gotten worse IMO.

France does not actively police it but the rules are used to refuse benefits to eu citizens who are not legally resident. But surely the point is that if people know what the criteria are for France, they know they should not move here if they will no be able to meet them.
Many Brits seemedto think that freedom if movement meant carte blanche. They did not even realuse that it has conditions attached.

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I think many have never looked at the rules, where ever they go, and just thought (and some still do think) it was/is their right to go where ever they want and do what ever they please! :open_mouth: … and just shout loudly enough and the locals will understand you because everybody speaks English…, don’t they…?! :rofl:

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It’s not a very rigorous system of fingerprinting though as no EU citizens resident in France are required to provide fingerprints & there must be millions of them not to mention anyone from any of the Schengen states visiting or passing through France.

Everyone is fingerprinted when they pick up a titre de sejour.

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You’re missing the point, and being disingenuous. The point is that if you want a titre de séjour, you have to give your fingerprints. The French government are addressing the well known issue of fake ID documents that it had, as there were a number of robberies, smuggling, black market activities and forgeries of identification documents in the past that turned out were linked to gang and terrorist criminality (surprise, surprise). As an aside, it also allows the French authorities to check whether or not that person is wanted, or being searched, for an alleged crime in which that fingerprint was found. The French government has learned from past errors and has taken steps to remediate that for those people resident on its soil that want to have an ID card issued by the authorities. Nobody is saying it is perfect. The fact that other EU countries may, or may not, have similar systems, or even completely dissimilar systems, just goes to show how much sovereignty each member state still has with regard to the requirements it deems appropriate to apply in relation to people living in that state.
I hate bureaucracy as much as the next person, but as I have to deal with it on a professional basis pretty much every day, and if it means that by adhering that bureaucracy I get to have my TdS, which is a requirement for me to continue working in France as an independent, then I’ll de dotting the i’s and crossing the t’s to make sure I get it.

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Following online application last year in October for tire de sejour have just received an email from prefecture with a rendezvous in 10 days time.
They are 10 minutes apart for me and my wife.
All we need to take is our passport, a recent photo. Plus proof of address if changed since last October. Oh, and a copy of the email just received.
Hoping all is as simple as it sounds.

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Oh the “joys” of the fingerprint scanning machine :grin:

MOH has large, very rounded fingertips. The lady behind the desk at Agen was leaning on his fingers trying to flatten them enough so the machine could read them. Took about five goes. Then when we went to collect our cartes de sejour (this was 2 years ago) the machine asks for a finger at random to check it’s you - after 5 attempts the machine gave up. Because it was lunchtime the woman behind the desk basically said “just confirm who you are” and let us go. Otherwise I think we would still be there!

There are millions of EU citizens resident in France who don’t need to pick up a titre de séjour.

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If fingerprinting is so necessary to crack down on criminality & terrorism why don’t EU citizens resident in France need a CdS or to be fingerprinted? France is now the only EU state that does not require EU citizens to register their residence.

Had the same issue trying to register my fingerprints at the Prefecture - seems that the scanners they have, and the associated software don’t always cooperate very well.

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For an answer to that, you would have to ask the French government, I’m not privy to the discussions that went on in the parliamentary and senatorial commissions that decided to bring that measure in (although I imagine that there is some record somewhere). I also never said fingerprinting was “necessary” to crack down on criminality, but in the raft of measures that it had at its disposal, it chose to implement fingerprint scanning for all of those people who applied for any form of official identification - probably because in its view the benefits of doing so outweighed the inconveniences of a loss of individual liberty.

More information as to the files created by the French state to “watch over” its population can be found here:

A quick read of this indicates that the desire, or intent, of the legislator to take foreign nationals’ fingerprints is not new, and that one of the reasons invoked by the legislator was to reduce the occurrence of document fraud, and identity theft (but surely not the only one).

Fact check needed there. I am pretty sure Greece has no such requirement and that is off the top of my head, yiu will probably find others.

Of course many eu citizens will have been routinely fingerprinted in their country of origin and the eu shares security info.

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Big can be beautiful :wink: