@santiago102 if you are struggling then you can book a zoom with me and I’ll get to the bottom of it…. Have the paperwork to hand and I can check it out for you. Calendly - David Lawson
At the risk of possibly confusing this issue, should any former Channel Island (CI) public servants be following this topic, please be aware that the Double Taxation Agreement (DTA) between the UK and France related to government pensions does NOT apply to CI pensioners.
The CI tax authorities were deducting tax at source from my government pension for a number of years, even (questionably) for 3 years after the DTA situation was clarified in 2011- it took years to unravel and the french tax authorities were, overall, very understanding.
Am with hairbear on where to pay taxes - I receive the benefits of Frances public services and am happy to contribute to them through the local system.
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It will depend on the DTA between France and where the pension is domiciled. My understanding is there is a DTA for Jersey and Guernsey. As long as there is an agreement you won’t pay tax in both jurisdictions. If you speak to your pension provider they should know if you can be paid gross or if it has to be taxed where it is domiciled. If that is the case then you would declare the income as pension from overseas tax paid and receive a credit for the amount of tax liable in France meaning you’d only be paying tax where the pension is.
So check DTA (not sure what island as isn’t stated)
Speak to pension trustee
Declare correctly if France
Very interesting. The majority of my income is derived from pensions paid from Jersey, an occupational scheme for public employees and the statutory old age pension. I will seek advice from my french tax adviser before approaching the Jersey authorities as i would not wish to be detrimentally affected as regards health service provision etc. if I (re)start paying income tax to Jersey rather than France. Do you have any detail on the DTA between France and the CIs?
This is the DTA between France and Jersey…
This isn’t to say that your pension is taxable in France or Jersey just that you won’t be taxed twice. You need to understand if you should be paying tax on them in France or Jersey.
My thoughts although I don’t know and could be wrong is that it is likely your state pension will be taxable in France and is probably paid gross already and that your public service pension will be taxable in Jersey and declared but receive a credit in France. But you’d need to confirm this.
1. It is hereby declared that the arrangements specified in the Exchange of Notes
set out in the Schedule to this Act have been made with a view to affording relief
from double taxation in relation to income tax and taxes of a similar character
imposed by the laws of the French Republic and that it is expedient that those
arrangements should have effect.
Thanks for your investigations into this situation.
Unfortunately, the relief from Double Taxation Agreement to which you refer and, usefully, provided a link to, is from 1964 and seems to relate solely to profits from air and transport services.
I now receive both of my pensions gross from Jersey and pay taxes on them in France.
Whilst it may be fiscally advantageous for me to have my government occupational scheme pension taxed in Jersey I would prefer to pay taxes to the same authorities as that which provides me with services.
I wonder if others are happy in continuing to pay taxes to the UK governemnt when they have moved permanently to France?
I am neither happy or unhappy. It is what I am obliged to do for my occupational pension; my state pension is taxed in France. Il faut faire avec.
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I have young relatives in the UK, so if my tax can help at all in them having the (eg) NHS that I used to have then happy to support it. After all my social charges here go to unemployment, maternity etc benefits that I will never use so that’s my contribution to France.
@EmilyA is correct… it’s not a choice to make. Government pensions are taxed in the UK at source.
Yes, you are all correct in so far as the various tax authorities treat pensions paid from different jurisdictions, be those eminating from statutory provision, such as Old Age pensions, or occupational private/public service, in different ways.
My original post was meant to point out to former residents of the Channel Islands who were, or would be, in receipt of an occupational pension by dint of prior public service, that those pensions should be paid to them gross, and that the special arrangements which are applied to UK government pensions and which have tax deducted at source, do not extend to them.
Unless you are one of the few individuals who are financially fortunate enough to be able to claim non-domiciled status, as in the UK, or negotiate individual tax rates, as in Jersey, then you do not have a choice as to where, or how much, you pay in tax - but that is a whole other barrel of monkeys.
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Never heard the barrel of monkeys expression! I’m using this instead of ball game in the future!